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  • So this clan was able to go trough the warring states and survive just fine but out of nowhere they were simple gone?so what happened to them?

    kishimoto decided out of nowhere that they were supposed to be important and didn't bother to explain to us what happened to them?I really don't remember any mention of how strong they were in part 1,since it was stated that the uchiha clan was actually the strongest clan in konoha.

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    • They Probably were dissolved, likely due to three factors:

      1: being the strongest clan, they likely were sent out to war the most. With above-average representation come above-average casualties

      2: Since Ninja are predominantly men, the Senju would mostly consist of women. Women tend to take their husband's name. Thus they would get bred out of the Senju clan quickly

      3: Hashirama's wish was that people considered the good of the village over the good of the clan. With that, the clan (Or what was left after points 1 and 2) disbanded to prove this fact. Especially since the First and Second senju hokage would probably make some powerful clans ask for a guarantee that this isn't just Senju village.


      As to why he didn't mention it, likely for the same reason he didn't show Hashirama's death: no matter how fitting or realistic or good, people know them mostly as "the most powerful clan" and so would likely not be happy with any official version. Plus, it may signal a future plot device that could mislead readers. IE People see it mentioned, thus it will be a big deal later on.

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    • There even possibility of them living their ordinary life in Konoha without standing up too much. Considering there was no moment mentioning them like "You know your clan also died out.", when Hashirama and Tobirama spoke with Sasuke about Uchihas and their wipeout. But then again it may Kishi's usual bad writting.

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    • Rage gtx wrote: There even possibility of them living their ordinary life in Konoha without standing up too much. Considering there was no moment mentioning them like "You know your clan also died out."

      There is no actual mention of them dying out, just that the Senju clan no longer exists. Which rules out extermination.

      So, they probably got disbanded.

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    • There is still Senju Park according to Boruto anime tho.

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    • Elveonora wrote: There is still Senju Park according to Boruto anime tho.

      Presumably named in honor of the Senju.

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    • Well, from all the Senjus and Senju related characters very few had any importance: Hashirama, Tobirama, Tsunade, Mito, Kushina, Naruto

      The rest weren't important enough to came up with explanation why they died off (though it is funny considering for Uzumakis Kishimoto at least gave us vague "they were feared because of their Fuinjutsu and killed off")

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    • Bambusek wrote: Well, from all the Senjus and Senju related characters very few had any importance:

      Kushina and Naruto aren't senju.

      It's still pretty much the most important clan. Hashirama and Tobirama by themselves logged enough achievements for the entire clan, what with essentially creating the modern shinobi world and it's rules and institutions. Only the Uchiha, as far as i can recall, had more influence on the plot and that wasn't good influence.

      Bambusek wrote:

      The rest weren't important enough to came up with explanation why they died off

      They didn't all die off. Given that Tsunade is the granddaughter of a Senju, if there was some mass-dying or eradication of Senju, she'd at least have mentioned something. The Uchiha massacre was referenced a few times, while the Uzumaki massacre was not really mentioned until Kushina told Naruto, because of all the secrecy. But we've seen several Senju in the plot and and no point was there are reference to some mass dying.

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    • naruto's arm needs to get married and make some babies ASAP!!

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    • Simple: Kishi has written them off

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    • Thekillman wrote: Kushina and Naruto aren't senju.

      I know, but they are distantly related to Senju through Uzumaki clan.

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    • Bambusek wrote: I know, but they are distantly related to Senju through Uzumaki clan.

      That's a bit of a stretch. We have no idea how distant that relation is, it's possible that goes back to Ashura. It's like saying that Tsunade is not a very important Otsutsuki.

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    • Thekillman wrote: That's a bit of a stretch. We have no idea how distant that relation is, it's possible that goes back to Ashura. It's like saying that Tsunade is not a very important Otsutsuki.

      But it's been known throughout shinobi history that the Senjus and Uzumakis are distantly related.

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    • UltimaDude wrote: But it's been known throughout shinobi history that the Senjus and Uzumakis are distantly related.

      I know, and i'm not denying that. But suggesting that Naruto and Kushina are Senju-related characters in order to prove that Senju weren't influential comes across as extremely weird, since not only did the entire village accept the Senju Ideology, the entire world copied a Senju's ideas. Furthermore, Naruto and Kushina are Uzumaki first and foremost.

      Plus, since we don't know how distant that relation is, it's hard to tell exactly how strong that blood bond was. Worst case, it goes all the way back to Ashura's days, in which case claiming that Naruto is Senju-related is equivalent to claiming Hashirama is otsutsuki-related. technically true, but also pretty meaningless in practical terms. The Senju-Uzumaki bond existed also because of economic convenience and a long history of friendship. For all we know, they split off from Ashura's disciples 900 years ago and simply kept in contact regularly. Or they split off from the Senju 80 years (-ish) ago when the village was founded and they wanted to live somewhere else. We simply don't know.

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    • Thekillman wrote: Plus, since we don't know how distant that relation is, it's hard to tell exactly how strong that blood bond was. Worst case, it goes all the way back to Ashura's days, in which case claiming that Naruto is Senju-related is equivalent to claiming Hashirama is otsutsuki-related. technically true, but also pretty meaningless in practical terms. The Senju-Uzumaki bond existed also because of economic convenience and a long history of friendship. For all we know, they split off from Ashura's disciples 900 years ago and simply kept in contact regularly. Or they split off from the Senju 80 years (-ish) ago when the village was founded and they wanted to live somewhere else. We simply don't know.

      You're missing the point, but that's on me for not elaborating. What I'm trying to say is that if the split happen all the way back to Asura, then the fact that the Uzumakis and Senjus are related would be lost in history. Black Zetsu made no mention of the Uzumakis when he was talking about Indra's and Asura's descendants ("Indra and the Uchihas, Asura and the Senjus"). Therefore, the split must've happen much later, but before the founding of Konoha and the shinobi system

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    • UltimaDude wrote: Therefore, the split must've happen much later, but before the founding of Konoha and the shinobi system

      I don't think this is necessarily true. It appears that the Senju and Uchiha simply were the guardians of their forefather's ideology (will of fire versus Uchiha's might makes right) in addition to their genes. The Uzumaki appear to be genetically and ideologically related but not part of that very core group.

      Though to be clear, i don't think the clans formed immediately after Asura's and Indra's demise. But somewhere within that century or so, it appears their followers formed these clans.

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    • Thekillman wrote: I don't think this is necessarily true. It appears that the Senju and Uchiha simply were the guardians of their forefather's ideology (will of fire versus Uchiha's might makes right) in addition to their genes. The Uzumaki appear to be genetically and ideologically related but not part of that very core group.

      Though to be clear, i don't think the clans formed immediately after Asura's and Indra's demise. But somewhere within that century or so, it appears their followers formed these clans.

      That still doesn't change that there was possibily of a split much later after the founding of the Senjus.

      Whatever the case may be, the Uzumakis were originally part of the Senjus then later split

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    • UltimaDude wrote: That still doesn't change that there was possibily of a split much later after the founding of the Senjus.

      True. But my point was that based upon what (little) we know, it's extremely strange to count Naruto as "Senju-related" in the context it was used earlier.

      UltimaDude wrote: Whatever the case may be, the Uzumakis were originally part of the Senjus then later split

      There is no evidence for this. It's entirely possible that whatever proto-clan existed under Ashura simply split into Senju and Uzumaki clans. There's no actual mention of the Uzumaki splitting off. Hell it could just be 100+ years of common marriages that made them related eventually.

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    • Thekillman wrote: True. But my point was that based upon what (little) we know, it's extremely strange to count Naruto as "Senju-related" in the context it was used earlier.

      But....he is

      Thekillman wrote: There is no evidence for this. It's entirely possible that whatever proto-clan existed under Ashura simply split into Senju and Uzumaki clans. There's no actual mention of the Uzumaki splitting off. Hell it could just be 100+ years of common marriages that made them related eventually.

      If that were the case, then BZ would have mentioned the Uzumakis along with the Senjus when he was talking about Asura. The Senju clan had to have form way after Asura's demise in order to have enough members who all inherited Asura's dilutted genes. Though, you may be right

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    • UltimaDude wrote: But....he is

      Not in the context that was used, IE as proof/disproof that the Senju clan wasn't that influential/successful. He's not a member of that clan or sufficiently related to that clan to call it Senju success or failure.

      UltimaDude wrote: If that were the case, then BZ would have mentioned the Uzumakis along with the Senjus when he was talking about Asura. The Senju clan had to have form way after Asura's demise in order to have enough members who all inherited Asura's dilutted genes. Though, you may be right

      The Uzumaki don't really show the same (level of) ideology that the Senju do with their Will of Fire. It could also be a retroactive thing: Black Zetsu looked for transmigrants among the Uzumaki too, but found one among the Senju and Senju thereafter. So he simply omitted clans that didn't produce Transmigrants despite being eligible for them (ie Uzumaki).

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    • naruto is a transmigrant and one has to be a direct decendant to be a transmigrant, which means the uzumaki clan have to be directly decended from asura, since there has been no mention of asura's children forming both the senju and uzumaki clan, the only logical assumption is that the uzumaki clan is a branch off of the senju clan. and the fact that the uzumaki clan have such strong life force this would require them to have been decended from a particularly strong senju, my theory is that one of the past transmigrants broke off from the senju to form the uzumaki clan, possibly marrying someone from another strong clan. this would explain why the uzumaki are known for there strong life force

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    • Actionmanrandell wrote: since there has been no mention of asura's children forming both the senju and uzumaki clan, the only logical assumption is that the uzumaki clan is a branch off of the senju clan.

      There's also no mention of Hamura's clan splitting in two, yet we clearly have his descendants on the moon and the shinobi world.

      So no, i don't find it a logical assumption at all. Kinkaku and Ginkaku were said to be related to the Sage, yet they're not know to be Senju or Senju-descendant. I find it far more likely that the core support/family of Ashura founded the Senju and the periphery founded other, related clans. It seems that only the Uzumaki retained any strong political and economic connection though, hence that relationship was mentioned explicitly.

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    • Thekillman wrote: There is no actual mention of them dying out, just that the Senju clan no longer exists. Which rules out extermination.

      So, they probably got disbanded.

      Sorry for late response, but I don't remember at any point manga stating that clan no longer exists can you cite at least one occurrence, without it claim of whatever happened to Senju is baseless.

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    • Rage gtx wrote: Sorry for late response, but I don't remember at any point manga stating that clan no longer exists can you cite at least one occurrence, without it claim of whatever happened to Senju is baseless.

      Directly from the wiki:

      It isn't clear if the Senju still formally exist as a clan, as no living Konoha villagers are known to still bear the name. Konoha Hiden suggests that they are no longer active, as Kiba Inuzuka only recognises the name from history classes.

      They were THE most influential and powerful clan around. But in modern-day Konoha, no mention is made of them whatsoever as being alive. Even Tsunade, who is Hashirama's granddaughter, is never explicitly called Senju. This implies that they are no longer around. The Uchiha and Hyuga are mentioned as powerful clans in modern konoha, but the Senju are not mentioned.

      So, by their absence despite previous priminence, it's safe to conclude they no longer exist.

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    • So only cite is non-canon novel and wike self reference? Well then I don't agree it's safe to conclude that they no longer exist.

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    • Rage gtx wrote: So only cite is non-canon novel and wike self reference? Well then I don't agree it's safe to conclude that they no longer exist.

      They were the founding clan, the most prominent and most powerful clan, yet in modern times there's no even the slightest mention. The fact that Naruto - an Uzumaki, not a Senju- was the next transmigrant against the trend suggests so. The Uchiha are considered the strongest clan, despite the fact that the Senju were canonically stronger suggests that they are gone.

      The fact that there's so little mention of what happened to them suggests it wasn't considered a big deal, meaning that they probably disbanded. The fact that there's essentially no mention of modern-day senju despite being arguably THE most influential clan in the world suggests they're no longer around.

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    • Thekillman wrote: Not in the context that was used, IE as proof/disproof that the Senju clan wasn't that influential/successful. He's not a member of that clan or sufficiently related to that clan to call it Senju success or failure.

      Hmmm, I see

      Thekillman wrote: The Uzumaki don't really show the same (level of) ideology that the Senju do with their Will of Fire. It could also be a retroactive thing: Black Zetsu looked for transmigrants among the Uzumaki too, but found one among the Senju and Senju thereafter. So he simply omitted clans that didn't produce Transmigrants despite being eligible for them (ie Uzumaki).

      This is base on absolutely nothing. How would one show the same level of ideology as another? Heck, Hashirama's father and other Senjus didn't show any level of believing in the Will of Fire. If Asura's transmigrants were Senju after Senju, wouldn't that tell you that the Uzumaki clan was founded after the founding of the Senju clan?

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    • UltimaDude wrote: This is base on absolutely nothing.

      We don't have much to go on, so that makes sense.

      Hagoromo implied that the Transmigrants can choose their host. So there isn't nearly as much weight behind the Senju/Uchiha clan being picked as it seems. It's just that both clans seemed to fulfill their ideology the best. Or perhaps these clans allowed the Transmigrants to achieve the most, the Senju and Uchiha were the strongest clans after all, and what better way to change the world than to be the leader of the strongest clans?

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