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  • which character do u wish that wouldn't have died, and trained to become much stronger than what we have previously seen?

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    • Again, Neji. As it was mentioned in the previous threads, such a potential of his calibre got wasted for no reason at all.

      Also, this goes for more characters who showed great abilities even in their the youth but died young and didn't have a chance to develop them more, I speak about the likes of Kimimaro or Haku. Or even Itachi and Shisui.

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    • I was always thinking of yahiko, and such. he could've been minato lvl easily. now that I think bout it, minato died as well, didn't he? think minato would be one of the wasted potential?

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    • Lorenzo.r.1st wrote: I was always thinking of yahiko, and such. he could've been minato lvl easily. now that I think bout it, minato died as well, didn't he? think minato would be one of the wasted potential?

      Except it was the point of the characters that they died early. The themes surrounding them simply wouldn't be the same. Yahiko was ultimately immortalized as the face of Pain. Minato's early death and how he was unable to fulfill his true potential is i think referenced at least 3-4 times.

      In retrospect, Neji should've died in Part 1. I don't think the nature of the series would work very well for the Hyuga as they'd inevitably be measured against the Uchiha and anything they do would inevitably be either "too OP" or "useless compared to the Uchiha".

      Haku i'm not sure about. Cool ice powers that could've been extended significantly? sure. Deep character that deserves to be explored more? Nope.

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    • yeah, I remembered that thread that someone made a few days ago (bout minato), and it kinda stuck, so I thought of making a 'memorial for dead warriors' type-thread.

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    • Not sure about Yahiko, since we've barely seen anything related to his abilities. We only know about his Water Style affinity and possible kenjutsu skills, but nothing more. He really was a major authority for the initial Akatsuki group, but it doesn't necessary mean his authority was based on his superior power level.

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    • Lorenzo.r.1st wrote: yeah, I remembered that thread that someone made a few days ago (bout minato), and it kinda stuck, so I thought of making a 'memorial for dead warriors' type-thread.

      Just to be sure: I love minato as a character and i do think it's a shame he didn't get to achieve his height in death. Giving him Kurama felt thematically rather weak, as it didn't really add to his character (and any power it gave him was already present in Naruto so it felt like a duplicate). And i do think it's a shame we never got to see that ultimate Minato form. But it would also have cheapened everything about him if he lived somehow.

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    • anybody here miss zabuza? I wish I he was still alive.

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    • Lorenzo.r.1st wrote: anybody here miss zabuza? I wish I he was still alive.

      I don't know, i kinda liked his send-off.

      I think that the jinchuriki are probably the primary characters i'd like to have seen more off. There's basically an endless sea of potential stories, abilities and animal themes that could've been explored with them. IE the two tails seemed to work together with her jinchuriki. What's the story behind that? Son Goku was as friendly as we got with his jinchuriki. Feels like there's so much to explore there.

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    • true. what about the sound four? the edo kage, swordsman of the mist, or paku and gari. maybe asuma?

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    • Lorenzo.r.1st wrote: true. what about the sound four? the edo kage, swordsman of the mist, or paku and gari. maybe asuma?

      Sound four: I think their usefulness was spent. I really like Kidomaru, so maybe i would like to see more of him. But i think the series and it's themes would need a very different direction to really pay it off. Go down the whole paid-for-murder route, the whole "a ninja's body is a great treaure" thing up to eleven. I've talked about Kidomaru's abilities plus stuff like Shikotsumyaku and byakugan and stuff. Well, i think to really pay off his character you'd need to make him a warrior with more physical powers.

      Edo Kage were fine. I think the whole Edo thing was a bit over the top. I mean, we had the whole "ninja body = treasure" thing, but apparently those treasures are poorly guarded.

      Swordsmen: I don't know. The Naruto series doesn't really do the whole Special Swordsmen thing (Unlike, say, One Piece where a swordsman can cut a boat in half despite the physical impossibility, and cut things with sheer will).

      Paku/Gari: Interesting abilities, uninteresting characters. To me it felt they were introduced as some "and this ability also exists" character.

      Asuma: Not without a change in themes. Him being the son of the Hokage is an interesting thing and his wind release was rare. He was also part of this strange order of Guardians (or whatever it was called). Definitely seems like a lot was going on there. Considering the rest of the series though, i struggle to come up with ideas to make it fit. So yea, not without a change in end-game themes.

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    • I see. would've been nice if blue bee didn't die

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    • Lorenzo.r.1st wrote: I see. would've been nice if blue bee didn't die

      I don't know, what makes you like Blue bee? I didn't think he was that interesting

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    • for one, only if he existed, we could see a lot of young bee, ay, and the 3rd raikage, as flashback. I like those 3 ninja a lot,

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    • You forgot about Third Kazekage? He had so much potential (iron sand manipulation, magnet release kkg, S̶h̶u̶k̶a̶k̶u̶ ̶j̶i̶n̶c̶h̶u̶r̶i̶k̶i̶, etc) and even hailed as the Strongest Kazekage in Suna's history before killed by Sasori. It's unfortunate that we've never seen him going all-out.

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    • he wanst a jinchu, btw

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    • Oh yeah i'm sorry, ignore that part.

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    • Minato - He could have perfected the rasengan ane become awwwweeesssommmmee!!!!

      P.S He already was P.S.S Was he Sannin Level

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    • Haku.

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    • Well IMHO Haku was probably at his prime state that is he might as well reached his limits other than getting more experience and knowledge. I mean Kakashi once said that he cannot even match Naruto's Chakra reserves even how much he trained, it was just genetically impossible. So I guess, taking that from what most characters who are dead they most probably wouldn't improved that much. I mean remember Orochimaru once said that sasuke still ahd alot of potentiel enough to surpass madara he said. this means that not everyone who dies young befode they get old has immense just because they showes quite a impressivve feat or something like that. That is why I don't think Hokage Minato could improve at all. I mean he would have too much reponsibility as Hokage since we already saw that he didn't pursue his training for the next step of Rasengan, that is adding a element or Mastering Sage Mode. this proves that if he didn't die young he would probably get rusty and his chakra reserves everything would be reduced. He would probably be like Hiruzen who himself could have been a ninja like Jiraya(old but youthful) but much more powerful. Even Neji was said to learn everything about his byakugan. and as we know it Neji has never showed anything other than his byakugan abilities so he might as well would not have that much better than he was before. And yes I know we can all agree that there can also be characters with alot of potentiel but just died before they reached it. But by that logic can't we all say that every character could have been like Gai and Lee who were able to achieve their power without any special clan ability or talent. they would just have to train for it hard enough.

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    • well, its not like orochi knew how strong madara was, in the first place, and second, right after the kage summit arc (literally, right after), sasuke was already blind. he would never reach madara lvl

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    • Sasuke was well on his way to become Madara level. His development kind of skyrocketed with the Rinnegan, but throughout the series he was still continuously improving with no indication of slowing down.

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    • He lost an arm which weakened him tho.

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    • Sasuke isn't on Madara's level, nor will he ever be. Hagoromo said that Madara was getting close to his mothers power. Kaguya was always more powerful than Hagoromo. If Madara was getting close to his mother, then Madara was closer to Hagoromo's level than anyone else in the series. Sasuke is far from Kaguya, meanwhile Madara was getting close to her level, as state by a character that has battled Kaguya at her worst and knows her power better than anyone.

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    • Agreed. Orochimaru is a known Sasuke fanboy. Don't get me wrong, Sasuke is actually one of my most favorite characters in the series, but lets be real... Sasuke lost an arm, there are no more older brothers to kill and villages to destroy and Naruto isn't being clingy anymore.

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    • Princeharris1993 wrote: Sasuke isn't on Madara's level, nor will he ever be. Hagoromo said that Madara was getting close to his mothers power.

      He said "my and my mother's power"

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    • Lorenzo.r.1st wrote: anybody here miss zabuza? I wish I he was still alive.

      I do, lots of potential for develloping his backstory, personality and abilities (almost more so than Haku in fact), but if he had lived it'd have been more of a hindrance than an actual benefit for the plot, (except for Choujuro who might've had some wisdom to gain from his senpai or providing Intel about the underworld). As a missing-nin he'd have been hunted like a mad animal and even if he had been imprisoned he naturally couldn't haver done much.

      another character offed before their time I think is Konan, I wish she had survived her battle with Obito, her providing Intel for the alliance would have been a really good start for her redemption instead of simply dying, which is basically the easy way out/traditional for manga characters (that whole seppuku thing).

      Haku would've been interesting too, but given his personality it'd be hard for him without Zabuza to tell him what to do, without him, he'd not do a single thing I'm afraid.

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    • @Elveonora. Yeah Sasuke did lose a arm but that doesn't actually slow him down. he most likely improved with one arm as see him using one handed seals and using his sword with just one arm. I know that one hand might seem to make him weak but he already seems to have conditioned his whole fighting moves with just one hand like Taijutsu and Kenjutsu. And Ninjutsu and Genjutsu where he also experts doesn't change a bit for him. And anyways it really isn't like he doesn't have a chance to get another Hashirama hand(With a insane boost of power and strength by it). And yes theres no older brothers to kill him or Naruto that annoys him to motivate him to get stronger but there's something more... Like now as the wish of his Brother he protects the village from the shadows and for that he will train I'm sure of that(we already seen how powrful he got in The Last). And then we learn that he discovers a new threat, a threat that he deems greater than kaguya, so I guess they might as well train for the threat I mean it was like 7 years right? Yeah and Sasuke favorite hobby other than walking and all is training. and he pretty much still tries to surpass Naruto but in a kore friendly than he used too.

      @PrinceHarris. You're talking about Madara who took all the tailed inside him to get stronger? Well if you didn't know the most latest version if madara was the one that got out of Kaguya who was not at all at the level he was. But if comparing Rinnegen Madara and Adult Sasuke. Well both had powerful chakra, while one was already said to have same chakra power as a teen than the one who was at his prime(at his first life that is) and the his chakra was getting more and more powerful. They both unlock MS. Don't know at which age Madara unlocked his. They both have EMS. and I'm sure Madara got his when he was much older. And taking from both of their MS ablities, that is, Sasuke with Amaterasu and it's controlling power. While Madara only showed the ability to identify a clone from it's orginal which is good but still. And now taking their last MS power which is Susanoo, Madara at his prime(I guess) had a Perfect susanoo, impressive feat but we should also note that he had many years to reach that level. Sasuke had already completed his Susanoo with a full body susanoo and can use his susanoo with his MS abilities to make it stronger and can mix Curse Mark senjutsu of another character to make it a Senjutsu susanoo. He then Evolved his susanoo into it's final stage and his had wings so it already seems to be stronger Madara's and not to mention he mixed it with other tailed beast chakra to make it stronger.

      they both have rinnegen but sasuke's had shown to be more powerful and unique with his. examples would be him using rinnegen genjutsu to make them all other his control at one glance(even Hags was impressed by it) then sealing them all into chibaku tensei. And there many mire exames that I don't think is necessary. this is my opinion of Sasuke having potentiel to surpass Madara(which he already did).

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    • @BlazeRelease
      Haku was capable of using single hand seals something sasuke could do only in adulthood despite having sharingan.
      He had excellent nature transformation learning 2 at his age and perfecting his KKG. And his chakra control was excellent given his use of chakra to enhance speed and attacking power. Give him a reasonable sword training(hidden mist sword ) and he would be kage level warrior at very tender age. Allow him to master various other nature transformation and jutsu and we have candidate capable of surpassing most Kekkei genkai users, the sanin and even mangekyou users without Susanoo. I think he would become a well balanced fighter.

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    • Well, chakra is made of physical and spiritual energies, right? So it's likely that missing body parts results in decreased chakra capacity. And it's true that Sasuke got some of the powers he shares with Madara at a younger age, but Madara seems to have the superior body and battle expertise.

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    • How do you make a discussion like this? I have tried but I never succeeded.

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    • what do u mean? u don't how to make one? go to the top of this thread, where it says forum, right on top of the name "dead characters", click on it, and u will get a few choices on how to make one.

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    • The obvious choice would be Neji, but I dunno. To be honest, he didn't seem much stronger in part 2 compared to part 1 despite achieving rank of Jonin, so would he got better during Blank Period if he survived the war? Maybe, maybe not, especially that during war Kaiten was the only technique that put him ahead of Hinata. The good measurement of what Hyuga are capable of would be Hiashi, but we didn't saw him fighting much either.

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    • @NamikazeNaruto. If you're going to add things that Haku never did then why don't you add him the eight gates as well? Yes Haku had good chakra control and he did it at a very young age I suppose? But that doesn't really mean he has potentiel of being kage level. I mean many characters who were obiviously stronger than him did not use one handed seals so that doesn't make him that great. Sasuke mastered Chidori and fireball techniques enough to not use hand seals. so there's that. Haku's speed was already being defeated by a one/two sharingan sasuke. if Haku didn't use his needles at naruto to make sasuke protect him he might as well lose the battle. He himself said that Sasuke was winning at that match and that he was losing his chakra.

      @Elveonora. yeah Madara is much older than him and has much more of a body than sasuke at that age.We still haven't seen much of adult sasuke.yet we seen sasuke going nicely against a sage mode and six paths enhanced rinnegen madara before even getting enhanced.I mean if you are comparing the body of the two yeah madara seems to have a better body. but that body thing doesn't really seems to have any sense in naruto. I mean it's mostly chakra in your body that judges your strength and if you are comaparing bodies sasuke's seems to be more akin to Kakashi's body like more agile and speedy than madara who seems to have a more of a warrior's body which is mostly for battling in a more taijutsu wise way(as he is also a master of taijutsu) And about the hand missing thing. well I don't really think each body parts have chakra I mean isn't it more likely chakra is sent to each body from the (I don't know for sure but) Heart or something in the middle part of the body? I mean they need to first knead chakra and then release to each part of the body. if I'm right then without a hand to power up he has an extra hand size chakra for him now. And we should also know the fact that he always has a hand waiting for him when he wants it(A Hashirama Hand that is). And then finally I would like to say that Madara lost his Ten tails and now if he ever gets revived(that is as a six paths enhanced rinnegen madara) or something he wouldn't be able to win against neither Sasuke nor Naruto.

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    • @BlazeRelease
      I don't remember Haku's speed being defeated by Sasuke. Mind quoting me the instance? Wait a sec didn't sasuke 'deduced' that Haku was slowing down because of prolonged chakra use. And wasn't it the 'plot' (aka Haku no wanting to kill the kids) That saved both? Especially Sasuke.
      Somehow you aren' t getting the OP saying if the character stayed alive and trained? And Haku's training could have become stronger with a Mist sword and further increase of nature transformation. His speed and accuracy are already a beast at such age.

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    • lol actually, haku was trying to kill them the whole time, since he said that sasuke kept dodging his killing blows so, yeah... when sasuke faced haku for the first time, sasuke had to use chakra to jump into the air, as a means to dodge haku's ice release, and when haku was throwing those needles at him, haku himself said that sasuke was only capable of avowing definite mortal wounds, but still got hit anyways.

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    • @NarutoNamikaze. yes I know what this thread said but I really it means mostly from the potentiel of the dead character. that is Haku stayed with Zabuza for so long still he never thought to learn kenjutsu(which you had implied to make at a kage level, so really why didn't he?) he learned accurately shooting needles instead. Zabuza already knew Haku was talented yet one of the famous swordsman of the of the mist did not think of teaching him that? Haku was clearly trying to kill. when he said he would take out all obstacles to help Zabuza reach his goal. and yes I know Haku was slowing down. what do you expect from a living ninja? he's not a edo you know? he has to have a limit just like any other living ninja. Haku was afraid that he will lose that battle and had to strike at naruto to make sasuke sacrifice himself to win. Even Zabuza admitted to be amazed that sasuke could hold himself against Haku and realised later Haku was fighting an Uchiha and that's why he could match him. and about the earlier single hand seal mark thing. Did you not notice the fact that sasuke only started using after he had no other options. like he just did it because he could not use basic two handed seals anymore. it was from more of a whim than what you are saying. And what do you mean even with sharingan? I mean all the other three main uchihas in the show never did too yet even though they were quite older than him at that age. and I think would like to bring the fact that he surpass even the hand seals thing. like he doesn't even use hand seals for chidori or fire techniques.

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    • @Blaze, missing arm, less cells, less physical energy, less chakra, simple math.

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    • Elveonora wrote: @Blaze, missing arm, less cells, less physical energy, less chakra, simple math.

      I don't think he has less chakra just because he's missing an arm. I'm pretty sure it will just allocate somewhere else

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    • do u get tired faster without a leg, just cuz there's less places for blood to flow through?

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    • In regards to Sasuke having less chakra and Stamina because he's one arm short, I can definetly see the point of less cells=less psysical energy and thus less chakra.

      On the matter of Haku, yes, I definetly think he could have been on Kage level if he recieved more (far more) training. Kid was a genious and did quite well against Sasuke and Naruto, if he'd wanted to kill them, the maga would've ended then and there. His morals prevented him from delivering a killing blow. Sasukes ability to dodge didn't mean that he didn't get wounded. Concerning Hakus apparent lack of kenjutsu: he was never shown wielding a bladed weapon, therefore no one can define his skill in that dicipline. It's highly likely that Zabuza taught him that particular skillset (their pages refer to him having taught Haku every figthing technique he knew and that would naturally incorporate kenjutsu) and he just chose not to utilise it. Kenjutsu simply didn't fit his figthing style, which is a similar way that elemental release didn't suit Kankuros or Tsunades respective figthing styles, despite them having access to numerous different elements, it simply wasn't what they focussed on.

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    • Tzao wrote:

      In regards to Sasuke having less chakra and Stamina because he's one arm short, I can definetly see the point of less cells=less psysical energy and thus less chakra.

      I don't think it has a meaningful impact. We've seen that the heart is the primary source of chakra (to the point you can live just as a heart). I don't believe missing an arm reduces your chakra in a way that is noticeable

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    • @Thekillman The heart is not the source of chakra.....

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    • well, it would make if it was. remember kakuzo?

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    • At least we can conclude that the source of chakra is in the middle part of the body since we already saw that it has to rotated or something and then is send to each path of the body through the chakra pathway system, without a hand to give chakra it just leaves a hand size chakra amount left for extra use I guess.

      @Tzao. If missing a part of your body causes chakra/power loss then by that logic shouldn't ten tails Madara lose half of his power/chakra after sasuke cut half of his body?

      Chakra most likely is transported through the whole body hence why the chakra pathway is used. Basically transporting chakra to each part of the body and not the other way around. mental and phyical energy is mixed to use chakra so they just can't mix just like that. I think they have to be properly brought together(in the middle part of the body/heart)to then form chakra.

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    • UltimaDude wrote: @Thekillman The heart is not the source of chakra.....

      Explain then kakuzu and Sasori. You can't. Sasori was literally just a heart in a puppet. The heart is the (primary) source of chakra. This is also supported by the Eight Gates, where the final gate is the heart.

      Losing an arm isn't gonna reduce his chakra levels in any meaningful way whatsoever.

      BlazeRelease wrote: mental and phyical energy is mixed to use chakra so they just can't mix just like that. I think they have to be properly brought together(in the middle part of the body/heart)to then form chakra.

      Judging by the Eight Gates, chakra is mostly molded in the torso.

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    • yeah, I said the same thing. but then again, what's up with human puppets?

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    • Lorenzo.r.1st wrote: yeah, I said the same thing. but then again, what's up with human puppets?

      I don't think human puppets have their own chakra source. Rather, i think Sasori simply runs his chakra through their cells and somehow transforms that into the puppet's chakra. Like a very advanced medical ninjutsu.

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    • their cells are either dead, or they don't have them anymore, since they are now made of wood.

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    • Human puppets are made of an actual human body instead of wood, otherwise they'd be completely the same as regular puppets and weren't even called "human puppets".

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    • so human bodies can open their mouths to throw a shit load of poisonous needles? didn't know human bodies could shatter, nor break.... did I say that human bodies only have 2 arms and legs, and hands and feet instead of swords and such?

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    • Thekillman wrote: Explain then kakuzu and Sasori. You can't. Sasori was literally just a heart in a puppet. The heart is the (primary) source of chakra. This is also supported by the Eight Gates, where the final gate is the heart.

      Kakazu can easily remove hearts and it is easier to integrate into himself ,while in battle, than other parts of the body. The same can be said about Sasori. The entire body is the primary source of chakra, not the heart, otherwise:

      • Orochimaru wouldn't be able to completely resurrect out of those with the Curse Mark
      • Karin, probably the best non-Rikudo sensor in the series, couldn't properly sense Kabuto who injected himself with the blood of many individuals.
      • Users of the Eighth Gate would start with the heart, the so-called source of chakra
      • Chakra wouldn't constantly be depicted as being made in the abdominal region

      Need me to go on? So, like I said, the heart is not the primary source of chakra

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    • Lorenzo.r.1st wrote: so human bodies can open their mouths to throw a shit load of poisonous needles? didn't know human bodies could shatter, nor break.... did I say that human bodies only have 2 arms and legs, and hands and feet instead of swords and such?

      The tools installed into the puppets (needles, swords etc) surely aren't made out of flesh, but the point is that they are installed into something that formerly was a human body with its insides (like blood and organs) removed. I thought Chiyo explained the mechanics behing human puppets' creation well enough.

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    • she didn't. at all. she said they were once human, but now they are semi-human weapons. literally.

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    • Edit: I was somewhat wrong, Chiyo didn't say this, but Sasori himself, though quite clearly. He noted that the he removes the insides like blood and organs from the human corpe, does some measures to protect the body from decay and then installs the weapons and traps into it.

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    • UltimaDude wrote: Need me to go on? So, like I said, the heart is not the primary source of chakra

      I said primary. It's not that the rest of the body doesn't generate chakra. The heart is simply the most important.

      Eight Gates doesn't start at the heart because it would kill you. It starts at the brain, AKA the thing you have most control over.

      Kakuzu could've stolen the blood and flesh of his opponents afterwards, but his jutsu makes specific use of Hearts, suggesting a greater significance.

      Why would Sasori become a puppet when it would absolutely destroy his chakra reserves? because it doesn't. He's a puppet so he doesn't even need blood, meaning that the choice of the heart as the only remaining human part can only be because he can't remove the main source of chakra.

      The human body simply isn't a uniform source of chakra, and losing arms is insignificant in the greater whole. You're free to disagree on everything else, but arguing that Sasuke has lower reserves because of his lost arm is simply irrelevant.

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    • Thekillman wrote: I said primary. It's not that the rest of the body doesn't generate chakra. The heart is simply the most important.

      Eight Gates doesn't start at the heart because it would kill you. It starts at the brain, AKA the thing you have most control over.

      Kakuzu could've stolen the blood and flesh of his opponents afterwards, but his jutsu makes specific use of Hearts, suggesting a greater significance.

      Why would Sasori become a puppet when it would absolutely destroy his chakra reserves? because it doesn't. He's a puppet so he doesn't even need blood, meaning that the choice of the heart as the only remaining human part can only be because he can't remove the main source of chakra.

      The human body simply isn't a uniform source of chakra, and losing arms is insignificant in the greater whole. You're free to disagree on everything else, but arguing that Sasuke has lower reserves because of his lost arm is simply irrelevant.

      It's still not the primary source of chakra for the reasons I listed above

      You literally have no control over your brain. The reason why the Eight Gates stop at the heart is because it's arguably the most important organ in the body, not that it's a main source of chakra

      The heart is the easiest thing for Kakazu to remove and integrate into himself whilst in battle

      Yet Orochimaru can be completely resurrected with only flesh,that loosely matches with his, and his chakra.

      Not once have i argued that Sasuke missing his arm would lower his reserves

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    • why not an arm, since he has those swirly thingies in his, as the most common place in his body with said swirly thingies.

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    • Konan maybe but I kind of like her send off. I don't know, I kind of don't have any issue with characters dying before fulfilling their potential in strength I get more upset when I feel the death harms the story...but maybe swap Neji with Sai because c'mon.

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    • Neji or Haku. Neji got yopped off to progress Naruto and Hinata which is flat out patheic. Kill off Hinata's father instead. Yes, the impact won't be the same in regards to Naruto but it would of been still impactful towards Hinata. Neji being alive means he could of at least of been Guy's caretaker or Tenten's husband.

      Haku's death was great for the story but dude has so much potential which you could of killed of Zabuza and let him live if he wasn't a meat shield for him. Let's be honest, he looks 100x better than Sakura (I'm straight but just keeping it 100, even Naruto said it) so seeing him in Part 2 would of been glorious cause of his bloodline limits being expanded on.

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    • yo, image him in the 4th war?

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    • Ncduru wrote: Neji being alive means he could of at least of been Guy's caretaker or Tenten's husband.

      But isn't lee married to her?

      Ncduru wrote: Let's be honest, he looks 100x better than Sakura (I'm straight but just keeping it 100, even Naruto said it) so seeing him in Part 2 would of been glorious cause of his bloodline limits being expanded on.

      Damn man you nailed it...
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    • Namikazenaruto9 wrote:

      Ncduru wrote: Neji being alive means he could of at least of been Guy's caretaker or Tenten's husband.

      But isn't lee married to her?

      Ncduru wrote: Let's be honest, he looks 100x better than Sakura (I'm straight but just keeping it 100, even Naruto said it) so seeing him in Part 2 would of been glorious cause of his bloodline limits being expanded on.

      Damn man you nailed it...

      Nope, people just speculate that cause they were teammates. No one knows who Lee's wife is and honestly I'm not too interested in her. On Haku, yeah after the conclusion of the Hidden Mist arc he could of went on a training/reflection of life journey, returned in Part 2 and could of been a real asset towards the Alliance in the war. He would of been a great Anbu/spy

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    • Neji really shouldn't have been killed, I understand Kishi needed to choose a character we actually give a damn about to kill off but it shouldn't have been Neji.

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    • still miss jiraya though... cant lie, since he was my favorite character #jirayaforlife lol....

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    • Deidara, all he wanted was for someone to appreciate his art :((( I could see him as some sort of mentor(kind of like Jiraiya in terms of personality) if he were still alive. Maybe even Sakumo Hatake, I really want to see more of him.

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    • yup. I miss asuma. he could've done some good in the war, as well as neji's dad

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    • I hated the fact that shikamaru's dad, ino's dad, mabui and all those people a the base in the last shinobi war all died from an artillery shot from the ten tails from idk several miles away? That was stupid.

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    • that wasn't stupid. I think it allowed Shikamaru and ino to mature ALOT. Ino discovered the capability to communicate with alliance without enhancement. Shikamaru became really great strategist. And it made the loss of people in war real making the mind set tense and serious.

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    • Ancladar wrote: I hated the fact that shikamaru's dad, ino's dad, mabui and all those people a the base in the last shinobi war all died from an artillery shot from the ten tails from idk several miles away? That was stupid.

      Why? it was a great moment as it showed Madara's tactics and how he mirrored what the Alliance was going to do.

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    • Ancladar wrote: I hated the fact that shikamaru's dad, ino's dad, mabui and all those people a the base in the last shinobi war all died from an artillery shot from the ten tails from idk several miles away? That was stupid.

      It's a war, people die you can't just have a war arc in a story and not kill anyone.

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    • Starscream1998 wrote: It's a war, people die you can't just have a war arc in a story and not kill anyone.

      Well, the edo tensei were already dead and the Zetsu are arguably barely living things, so on Madara's side there weren't really casualties ;)

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    • Nope, can't pull off a war arc without impactful deaths this is not Fairy Tail this is Naruto.

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    • hahaha dude, no lie.

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    • I didn't mind characters dying. I minded them dying in stupid ways. A legit battle is one thing, being sniped from several dozen miles or more away from the battlefield and not being able to even outrun the blast at ninja speed is bull.

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    • well, if u take the speed, and the explosion size of that bijuu bullet, its almost illogical to try and run from it

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    • They had several minutes to say their goodbyes to their children. That should have been plenty of time to escape. Five minutes when you can run likely faster then a horse should be plenty of time to outrun an explosion, put up some kind of defense, summon a bird or transport summon, something. Not that it should have happened since it shouldn't have been able to fire a blast that accurately from that far away.

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    • Lorenzo.r.1st wrote: hahaha dude, no lie.

      Don't get me wrong I love Fairy Tail but it has established its tone thoroughly as a light hearted adventure so I actually don't like Fairy Tail characters dying senselessly in a war.

      But Naruto, Naruto doesn't have to be dark, edgy, gritty or any of that crap that people think makes a story more 'grown up' but the Shinobi World was established to be hell so I can see why some people complain that the 4th Shinobi World War wasn't as bloody but at the same time Naruto's theme and tone is all about positivity, achieving the impossible and is light hearted in it's own right so I don't share that complaint. A complaint I do have is instead of killing a character who has a promising future they could have killed a character like Sai who despite being underdeveloped walked the line between the traditional sense of being a Shinobi and being a human struggling to reclaim his emotions giving an air of tragedy in the wake of his death.

      This would give his character concept in the eyes of the audience a much needed redemption and elevate him from just being a stand-in cardboard cut out to fill in the space before Sasuke Uchiha gets back and fills it.

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    • that's... a very good idea/thought..

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    • Thank you, I'm not Kishimoto so I won't say I could have done the story better and I enjoyed it immensely...even though Edo Madara's reveal was probably when I got a little pissy...and then completely livid at Kishi with Tobi's reveal...and then screamed my lungs out when Kaguya became a thing...but all in all we should still be thankful to Kishimoto for giving us a mostly awesome story even if he ended up changing the final villain 3 damn times but hey ho.

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    • Starscream1998 wrote: But Naruto, Naruto doesn't have to be dark, edgy, gritty or any of that crap that people think makes a story more 'grown up' but the Shinobi World was established to be hell

      What i liked about Naruto is that it was both. It thoroughly and repeatedly established that the world is hell, and it most definitely was dark and gritty (or whatever the buzzwords are nowadays. same filling different packaging). The humor served to contrast that nicely, either as a coping mechanism (IE Naruto is annoying because he desperately wants attention) or as genuine relief. That despite being hell, people could laugh and have fun. that friends could be made even when it was unlikely, and that enemies could just be regular guys caught in a death spiral.

      But that nuance got lost more and more. Even though the world was repeatedly shown to be hell, we have Naruto overcoming things with the Power of Love, when it so often makes no sense. Obito's remarks during the 4th War were all cutting really really deep, but all Naruto could do is respond with "well, because i'm a True Believer". It's a war where half the ninja population gets wiped out, but nobody actually kills an enemy to keep it morally clean.

      IE: The zetsu are already dead beings from an age long past, and have essentially no chakra or personality or will of their own. you're not really killing people.

      The Edo tensei are already dead, so you're not killing people

      Kabuto was saved by The Matrix (Itachi having compassion for Kabuto was actually a nice point of nuance. I'd have done it differently, less deus-ex-machina style, but it was a nice point of nuance)

      Obito was almost killed by Kakashi (the unfortunate implication would be that he literally killed his entire team. The fortunate implication is that he already thought that, plus it would actually kill a mass murdering psychopath with the greatest power in the world right now) but saved by Black Zetsu so he could sacrifice himself, so Naruto also technically didn't kill him, even though his actions directly led to it.

      Naruto murders Kakuzu, but because Kakashi deals the killing blow his hands are technically clean. Meanwhile, Shikamaru straight up kills a dude and no fuss is made about that.

      Naruto straight up talks Nagato into suicide. This is despite the fact that at least Nagato had a plan, whereas Naruto's answer at this point was...nothing. Nagato could've forcefully united the world, which isn't entirely unlike how world peace gets established in the end.

      Time and again real problems are brought up (IE The Raikage wanting to kill Naruto to thwart Obito, since there's no indication whatsoever he can actually control Kurama and isn't just straight up handing Obito the prize) and brushed aside just as easily (Because power of faith).

      Naruto was the only reason Pain assaulted Konoha, and bringing him in was tactically stupid while it was a legitimate belief naruto couldn't handle Pain, yet Tsunade just goes "you need faith!".

      Naruto promises he won't let his comrades get killed as they literally are dying around him, yet the only retort is "just have faith!"

      Why spend so much time coming up with credible, realistic problems and then defend yourself with "because faith!" Especially since Pain's plan was ultimately put into work, as the world witnessed a great destructive jutsu that made them aware of their weakness while the most powerful being in the world guiding them. It just wasn't Nagato that guided people.

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    • I can definitely agree that the whole Naru-Jesus shtick does get a bit grating after a while.

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    • What bothers me the most about death in Naruto is tone shifting. Back in Part I, there was tension and sense of danger, as well as some fairly gruesome deaths (like those guys in the Forest of Death that got leeched). Then, as the series continued, it became evident that characters have plot armor, until the plot calls for a meaningful death (not that those were bad deaths though). But then the war happened, and it was supposed to be some grand event, except there was somehow hardly any tension (at least for me). Neji died after not getting any Part II development so it just felt random.

      This ties to my other major issue with the series, that being too many characters with too few getting proper development. Ideally, Naruto should have had fewer characters, a few meaningful deaths (that would progress the story) and, uhhh... Maybe less villain redemption. And definitely less messiah stuff.

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    • Right deaths for deaths sake are obnoxious. In Attack on Titan some deaths you feel more then others. Not going to say who dies, but some people you meet die almost instantly and you really don't care.

      Akame Ga Kill is the worst I've seen about death recently for so many characters get a single episode about them then die horribly. 1 episode is not enough for mst people to care about a make believe character. You need either a season or two for anime, and maybe a volume or two for me to get invested in a character. If Sasuke had died at the end of the Zabuza arc I don't think a huge amount of people would have been that upset since he hadn't done much at that point. Heck I like Hinata, but if she had died in the first part of Naruto I don't think I'd have cared since she only got the one fight in the chuunin exam to give us some backstory on her.

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    • From what I remember, Akame ga Kill (at least the manga) was meant to be over the top - the author was apparently inspired by old-timey ultraviolent Japanese action movies. So at least it turned out as intended. In Naruto however, we get a lot of preaching, but as the series went, the impact was lost.

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    • Ancladar wrote: Right deaths for deaths sake are obnoxious.

      While this is true, i think that there are a number of characters that (at least in the manga) served their purpose. I think this is also why people reacted so negatively to Neji, because it felt like he hadn't served his purpose yet.

      Starscream1998 wrote: I can definitely agree that the whole Naru-Jesus shtick does get a bit grating after a while.

      It's not the shtick itself that gets old, it's that there's no real counter-argument to criticism despite the fact that you can think of several. IE, the hellish situation of the Ninjaverse is mostly because people expect it to be hell, expect their enemies to be savages and so everything is fair and justified because everyone expects everyone else to do the same. It's one big self-fulfilling prophecy. Naruto could've pointed this out to Obito, that people die because he chose to kill them, that he sees only hell because he expects it to be hell, and that if he had chosen to use his power for good he could've done a lot of good.

      Similarly, despite wanting peace, Madara was perfectly willing to fight dirty to achieve his goal, despite the fact that it's this dirt that creates the hatred that fuels war. It was also a perfectly legitimate counterargument that despite the fact that there was war, there was an objectively less amount of war since Kaguya and even less since the formation of Villages. Besides, Hashirama wished children to have a chance to grow up in safety as his life-time goal, which he succeeded at.

      Kiadony wrote: In Naruto however, we get a lot of preaching, but as the series went, the impact was lost.

      Exactly. Conversion through Violence became too common. I think Naruto was mostly fine, but there are a few structural problems that could've been fixed with relatively little effort to significantly improve the story, especially the latter half.

      IE, i don't understand why despite being Transmigrants, neither Sasuke nor Naruto ever interacts with them. Wouldn't it have made a much bigger impact if both talked to their respective Transmigrant in stead of Hagoromo?

      IE, Biju being used as nuclear deterrents caused power inflation across the board.

      IE, Kurama being a bland biju caused 4th War naruto (where he learns to control that power after all) to be bland.

      IE, themes being setup (like inheritance of Clan powers) weren't paid off (Naruto not getting Adamantine chains but an unexplained Torii seal in stead), and themes of Sensei being setup that never paid off (e.g. Minato being Kakashi's sensei never really had any impact on Kakashi whatsoever, since he doesn't even use Rasengan)

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    • I admire that Naruto talks his villains out of their path to be honest, I think that's one of the best things about the story never mind the character. The only one I didn't want him to talk no jutsu was Madara but then Kaguya and a bunch of stuff before her happened and we didn't get the Big Bad we were promised.

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    • Starscream1998 wrote: I admire that Naruto talks his villains out of their path to be honest, I think that's one of the best things about the story never mind the character. The only one I didn't want him to talk no jutsu was Madara but then Kaguya and a bunch of stuff before her happened and we didn't get the Big Bad we were promised.

      Oh it was really cool that he did it a few times. But it sort of became his MO, in stead of an occasional freak occurence. It was very powerful with Zabuza because he was a "true ninja" who followed the rules and so shouldn't feel anything. Naruto's words getting through to him was a powerful demonstration that he was still human.

      Nagato is...well it works both ways. The problem with nagato is that his Rinne Tensei made the previous fight a lot cheaper, especially since Tsunade focuses so hard on saving people and in the end she may as well not have bothered.

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    • I kind of liked Nagato's Rinne Tensei in that I feel the focus of that arc was less about gritty character deaths and more so the intertwining of Naruto and Nagato as fellow students with clashing ideologies and how they both play a part in this prophecy. I'm happy that Rinne Tensei is never used again though otherwise that would be beyond my power to defend as anything but a cheapening of the plot.

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    • well, its a power we already know that exists, so if its used again, it cant be called plot, since we might as well expect it, instead of some new, weird, OP jutsu pulled out of someone's ass, don't u think?

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    • As I said I will not justify a second mass revival via Rinne Tensei I was merely defending Nagato's usage of the jutsu is all.

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    • I think u misunderstood my comments... im on ur side.

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    • Lorenzo.r.1st wrote: I think u misunderstood my comments... im on ur side.

      Sorry, I have trust issues and an overbearing need to explain myself in every interaction I have...I didn't say that out loud did I? I mean YES OF COURSE I KNEW THAT!

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    • lol... go to the black and ask for this: chill pills... they work wonders!!!

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    • Go to the black, well I don't know I mean I guess I have always liked the dark side more what with their excellent cookies.

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    • A FANDOM user
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