Talk:Seven Ninja Swordsmen of the Mist

Archives
Archive 1 Archive 2

3 Generations in the Fourth War Edo Team

File:Screen Shot 07-09-16 at 05.10 PM.jpg

Succession of the Swords

This chart was made using established information from the manga and anime, i'm posting it here to defend my trivia addition that being called the "greatest generation" is a misnomer, in that at least 3 generations were part of the Edo Seven Swordsmen, primarily that Ameyuri Ringo was replaced by Raiga before the Might Duy fight, while Zabuza and Mangetsu weren't part of the team until after the Duy fight (since their predecessors were present for the Duy fight and the Hozuki brothers were around during the same time as Zabuza) VlenFlyheight (talk) 00:18, July 10, 2016 (UTC)

Your point falls flat because there's no source saying whether Jinpachi or the other Shibuki wielder came first. There's also no actual source for whether Ameyuri or Raiga wielded Kiba first. Same for Hiramekarei, no source whether the unidentified wielder had it after or before Mangetsu. Your claim that in the manga only Fuguki is wrong. He's the only identified survivor, but nowhere does it say he was the only actual survivor and that the other six died in that fight. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 00:29, July 10, 2016 (UTC)

Raiga survived the Might Duy fight and lived into the next generation until he defected, his swords buried with him until Kabuto retrieved them, whereas Ameyuri died of illness and the swords were returned to Kirigakure. Zabuza, Raiga, Kisame, and Mangetsu were all active at the same time before their respective defections/deaths, they each new and acknowledged knowing each other at some point. There is no way Ameyuri and the four I just mentioned ever served on the same roster. Kushimaru and Jinpachi also being a noted tag team confirms that Jinpachi died before the Duy fight, since Jinpachi was not present and Kushimaru died in the Duy fight. VlenFlyheight (talk) 01:57, July 10, 2016 (UTC)

I'm a pretty avid Seven Mist Swordsman fan, and I have to weigh in with this guy, although perhaps it was only two generations? Either way when Raiga was made canon in Guy's younger days it proved that Ameyuri and Zabuza were never on the team at the same time. Shadowfox337 (talk) 02:09, July 10, 2016 (UTC)

Ameyuri dying in illness as well as Kushimaru and Jinpachi being tag team happened only in anime. --JouXIII (talk) 02:23, July 10, 2016 (UTC)

(edit conflict) Raiga's status in the manga is unknown, though most likely dead. That flashback is literally the only time he appeared. His death could have happened under completely different circumstances. Ameyuri's death by illness is anime-only, no indication in the manga how she died, or when. Those mean it's still perfectly possible for Ameyuri to have wielded Kiba after Raiga in the manga. Again, the manga confirming that Fuguki survived the Duy battle is not the same as it saying any of the other six died, so it's still possible that Jinpachi came after the unidentified Shibuki wielder. This is what you're not grasping. The six's status immediately after that battle is unknown. As JouXIII also pointed out, Jinpachi and Kushimaru being a tag-team is also anime-only. Zabuza, Raiga, Kisame and Mangetsu knowing each other does not mean they were active at the same time. Kisame knew Suigetsu, who never joined, along with Mangetsu, who did eventually join, so it's perfectly reasonable that members could know aspiring members. In fact, there's no actual confirmation between some of those. Kisame knew of Zabuza when he was first introduced in the manga, and in the anime, Raiga knew of Kisame and Zabuza (I think), but nowhere does it say Zabuza knew of Kisame. No mention of Zabuza and Mangetsu knowing either other. It's also possible that as the group was famous, those who join it would know of its previous members, while not necessarily having met them. That also means former members don't necessarily know future members. The thing that makes a claim like yours most difficult to be accurate is that there is no definition for defining a generation. When does it change? Every time the roster changes? Every few years? This is kinda like the Kage. The five villagers started having Kage more or less at the same time, but as time went along, each Kage served for different times, and the villages now have different numbers of Kage. Ōnoki was the third generation Kage in Iwa, but he ruled for decades, and the Kage of other villages probably changed many times during his rule. Minato was a Kage for like five minutes. Does that still count as a generation? Nothing in the manga invalidates those seven serving at the same, so the manga calling them the strongest generation isn't incorrect. If the anime added further restrictions that make it so it's not possible those seven served at the same time, then that's the anime's mistake, and the anime is at fault. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 02:52, July 10, 2016 (UTC)

Swordsmen and Kekkei Genkai

I was wondering if this counted as trivia. Most of the swordsmen have been partnered with kekkei Genkai users. Zabuza and Haku, Jūzō Biwa and Itachi Uchiha, Kisame Hoshigaki and Itachi Uchiha, Raiga Kurosuki and Ranmaru, Chōjūrō and Ao. Also, during the Fourth Shinobi World War, Zabuza and Haku were resurrected alongside Gari of the Explosion Style, Pakura of the Scorch Style, Toroi of the Magnet Style.--Hugues de Payens (talk) 14:09, October 15, 2016 (UTC)

I think it should be added that the all of the Swordsmen are based off of Zabuza. So what you are saying is correct only it looks like this.

Swordsmen/GGK Zabuza/Haku

Kisame/Itachi

Raiga/Ranmaru (noted to be based on Haku and Zabuza)

Chojuro/Ao (even noted to be based on the Look of Haku on his page)

Jinpachi/Kushimaru (Has a mask like Haku)

I am am sure there is more that shows them as pairs. Nerosmoke (talk) 19:13, December 13, 2017 (UTC)

Sword Separation

Considering the swords aren't exclusive to the group, would it be worth giving them their own article and name it "Seven Mist Blades"? --Sarutobii2 (talk) 14:35, October 20, 2017 (UTC)

I'm cool with that. Was thinking about this the other day. Munchvtec (talk) 14:37, October 20, 2017 (UTC)

They are exclusive to the group though. If you rightfully inherited the sword, you're apart of the Seven Swordsmen.--BerserkerPhantom (talk) 14:42, October 20, 2017 (UTC)

^naw, that would mean Suigestu is one of them cause he had the Executioner. The swords itself should have their own article as a collection w/ hyperlinks to the specific swords. {{SUBST:User:Ncduru/Sig}} 14:50, October 20, 2017 (UTC)

The key word here is rightfully.--BerserkerPhantom (talk) 15:40, October 20, 2017 (UTC)

Not sure why a collective article for the swords is necessary. Also, unless I'm mistaken "seven mist blades" is just a mistranslation. Whenever that term appeared in the subtitles, all I heard was "shinobigatana"/"shinobi sword". Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 15:54, October 20, 2017 (UTC)

I don't think they should have two different articles, for two reasons. First, as said by BerserkerPhantom, the seven swords are exclusive of the Seven Swordmen meaning that yes, "everyone" can steal and use them, but they are not the rightful owner. The second reason, and the "strongest" one, is that even if one can use one of the sword without being an official Swordmen of the Mist (see Suigetsu and Bee), the converse is not true: only someone who is entrusted with one of the blades can be called "one of the Seven Swordmen of the Mist". Gilgamesh85 (talk) 17:53, October 20, 2017 (UTC)

I'm just suggesting we separate it like a few other wiki's did, such as the Spanish wiki which i think called the article Demon Knives (妖刀).--Sarutobii2 (talk) 09:24, October 31, 2017 (UTC)

Considered Mystical?

"The swords of the Seven Swordsmen are passed down from generation to generation[1] since the First Mizukage's era, and are considered mystical" Does anyone know of the source for that last bit about being mystical? I can't find it anywhere in the databooks, but I might just be missing it. MindForged (talk) 14:51, June 13, 2020 (UTC)

Boruto episode 26 --Sarutobii2 (talk) 14:59, June 13, 2020 (UTC)

Previous wielder of Shibuki

The previous wielder of Shibuki during the clash with Duy has been edited to be Jinpachi. I am not certain of this, but if that is the case, the section detailing the two previous unknown wielders also needs to be edited. Arcadia warlic (talk) 01:45, 10 March 2022 (UTC)

It can't reliably said to be Jinpachi because the user has their face covered, this and other corresponding changes have been reverted. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 06:21, 10 March 2022 (UTC)

Indeed, I never said it could, I was just pointing it out so it could either be fully changed or reverted. Many thanks. Arcadia warlic (talk) 07:20, 10 March 2022 (UTC)