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Talk:Remote Chakra Cloak Manipulation

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Revision as of 07:04, June 7, 2013 by Speysider (Talk | contribs)

Seriously?

Really? This can easily be mentioned in his jinchūriki forms article. I see no need for the article. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 23:55, April 23, 2013 (UTC)

From the way it was presented, it seemed like a technique that Naruto used rather than a Jinchuriki ability. --SuperSaiyaMan (talk) 23:56, April 23, 2013 (UTC)
Why don't we add it in both? it does seem like a technique, and it's no different from a tailed beast skill, the way I see it. JaZZBaND (talk) 00:11, April 24, 2013 (UTC)
I don't know. It may not be on his body, but is still his chakra so manipulating isn't to odd, let alone a technique. And Naruto is a jinchuriki and it is manipulating demon chakra so yeah it would be a jinchuriki ability.--TheUltimate3 Allied Shinobi Forces Symbol (talk) 00:11, April 24, 2013 (UTC)
So you agree? this page should stay IMO. it's essentially no different from why we have the Chakra Transfer technique and Chakra sensing technique.JaZZBaND (talk) 00:14, April 24, 2013 (UTC)

IMO? Justin Holland (talk) 00:19, April 24, 2013 (UTC)

In My Opinion lol.JaZZBaND (talk) 00:21, April 24, 2013 (UTC)
this was not even showed to be a technique, should simply be added to jinchuriki skills or naruto's page. not a page of its own. not in any way did it seem like it was a skill either, obviously since its kurama's chakra on everyone, naruto could control it.--208.124.127.18 (talk) 00:32, April 24, 2013 (UTC)

You're completely wrong, here. JaZZBaND (talk) 00:34, April 24, 2013 (UTC)

Still don't see this as a technique of its own. A mention of it at either chakra control or jinchuriki ability. Giving this an article makes this out to be something far grander than it is. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 00:54, April 24, 2013 (UTC)
Can Killer B pull it off too, with him being a fellow Jinchuriki? Justin Holland (talk) 00:59, April 24, 2013 (UTC)
I think the article should stay. Its unique, and isn't something a jinchuriki can normally do. MangekyoSasuke (talk) 02:45, April 24, 2013 (UTC)
I agree, totally.JaZZBaND (talk) 03:10, April 24, 2013 (UTC)
It's no different than chakra arms, why shouldn't he be able to control his and kurama's chakra? Think of the cloaks around the alliance as extensions of Naruto's cloak--Elveonora (talk) 11:05, April 24, 2013 (UTC)
Are we keeping this or what? Justin Holland (talk) 14:44, April 24, 2013 (UTC)

SuperSaiyan, no offense but ur kinda annoying with your edits related to character feats and abilities, no need to make everything sound greater than it is--Elveonora (talk) 19:13, April 24, 2013 (UTC)

Except if its shown in the manga, it'd need an article. No other Jinchuriki can do what Naruto was doing. Added to the fact he can shape all the cloaks into one object also makes it seem more to be a technique.--SuperSaiyaMan (talk) 19:46, April 24, 2013 (UTC)
The alliance members aren't jinchuriky neither pseudo-jinchuriky, the shrouds around them are Naruto's chakras, it's Chakra Arms essentially, new techniques do not come out of nowhere. The feat can stay listed in the articles, tho this article for the "technique" should be deleted--Elveonora (talk) 20:01, April 24, 2013 (UTC)
Since when can Chakra Arms be controlled remotely? Shaped into wings or a giant bird shape? The manga presented it as a new technique, not just a standard ability of Jinchuriki.--SuperSaiyaMan (talk) 20:14, April 24, 2013 (UTC)
Since the moment author said so. "no other jinchuriky can do what Naruto was doing" that's because Naruto uses chakra transfer technique and converts it, no other jinchuriky is known to have possessed these skills, that's why.--Elveonora (talk) 20:34, April 24, 2013 (UTC)
He basically did via Kurama. He said no other person could do what Naruto is doing due to his Uzumaki blood and being Kurama's Jinchuriki all their life. No other Jinchuriki has remotely displayed chakra transfer period, much less remote controlling the cloaks they give.--SuperSaiyaMan (talk) 21:58, April 24, 2013 (UTC)
Wait, where did you hesr that from exactly? Justin Holland (talk) 20:41, April 24, 2013 (UTC)

[1] Explicitly said Naruto was the only one who can do this.--SuperSaiyaMan (talk) 22:10, April 24, 2013 (UTC) hesr? I don't speak your dialect ... :P--Elveonora (talk) 20:51, April 24, 2013 (UTC)

If you mean "get" Justin then elveonora-chan got that from the latest chapter possibly the one which cam out a month ago although I'm not sure, but as this Is a talkpage this article should be a candidate for deletion my opinion --Jmootam1999 20:55, April 24, 2013 (UTC)
Sorry, I meant hear, where did you hear that from? Justin Holland (talk) 20:56, April 24, 2013 (UTC)
He got It from the manga chapters he didn't hear it he got It --Jmootam1999 20:58, April 24, 2013 (UTC)
The chakra isn't sealed in the alliance members, it's like Naruto can make thrown Rasenshuriken explode on command, this works the same way, he manipulates the cloaks like chakra arms--Elveonora (talk) 21:04, April 24, 2013 (UTC)
Yes your right but do you think this article should be here? --Jmootam1999 21:07, April 24, 2013 (UTC)
No, sounds cool tho ;) it belongs best to chakra arms article--Elveonora (talk) 21:09, April 24, 2013 (UTC)

How about making this article Remote Chakra Manipulation instead, unless that's a bad idea too? Justin Holland (talk) 21:23, April 24, 2013 (UTC)

So having an exploding tag explode counts as remote chakra manipulation too? :P--Elveonora (talk) 21:18, April 24, 2013 (UTC)
NO, "Chakra", not tags, they can explode on denotation from being ignited. By the way, no one still answered a question i made a little bit ago, can Bee do this too? Justin Holland (talk) 21:23, April 24, 2013 (UTC)
I'll answer your question with another question: Has Killer Bee ran around the battlefield handing off the Eight-Tails chakra like candy?--TheUltimate3 Allied Shinobi Forces Symbol (talk) 22:04, April 24, 2013 (UTC)
Not once, not ever. More to the point, Kurama basically said Naruto was the only one who can do this due to being a Jinchuriki since he was born (most Jinchuriki get their Biju when their older, 2-5 the most common age we've seen) and because he was Uzumaki. --SuperSaiyaMan (talk) 22:18, April 24, 2013 (UTC)
What do you think after all this, Omni? Justin Holland (talk) 22:39, April 24, 2013 (UTC)
Thus what he does is Chakra Transfer Technique + Chakra Arms also with the tag thingy, some can be exploded with a handseal too, wouldn't that count as "remote" ? :)--Elveonora (talk) 22:48, April 24, 2013 (UTC)

This is derived from both Elveonora. Only Naruto has this technique. I wouldn't have even made this article in the first place if the cloaks didn't have the remote control factor with Naruto being able to manipulate them to protect others from a distance. --SuperSaiyaMan (talk) 22:52, April 24, 2013 (UTC)

Read the explosive tag and rasenshuriken examples, they are remote too.--Elveonora (talk) 22:55, April 24, 2013 (UTC)
Its not the same thing. Can you be a little less rude too-its like you don't want to see where I'm coming from and just being a jerk for no other reason than disliking the fact I even made an article.--SuperSaiyaMan (talk) 22:56, April 24, 2013 (UTC)
Be cool, everybody, just be Cool!! Justin Holland (talk) 22:59, April 24, 2013 (UTC)
See your point about the tags. But are the cloaked ninja the ones who control the cloaks? controlling cloaks made to match difernt chakra wavelengths while on the move? Justin Holland (talk) 23:04, April 24, 2013 (UTC)
Saiyan, it's EXACTLY the same thing, chakra can be manipulated at range, another example would be Wood Release: Cutting Technique, why should I be a jerk just cause you have made an article? That makes no sense, I'm a "jerk" cause I disagree with it not because it was made by you, but because it's false--Elveonora (talk) 23:09, April 24, 2013 (UTC)
Several of you need to learn how to indent so that other people are able to read the discussion. ~SnapperTo 03:50, April 25, 2013 (UTC)

I say delete. The remote manipulation of chakra is not something we're unaccustomed to. A lot of technique apply the use of remote chakra control, there's no reason for this article to exist in my opinion.--Cerez365Hyūga Symbol(talk) 22:08, April 25, 2013 (UTC)

So decided? :)--Elveonora (talk) 22:17, April 25, 2013 (UTC)
Wait, how about we just call this page tailed beast cloak? Justin Holland (talk) 23:09, April 25, 2013 (UTC)
Wouldn't quite work, unless you think there's a viable way of merging all "So and so's Jinchūriki Forms" articles. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 23:36, April 25, 2013 (UTC)
OK, then how about remote tailed beast chakra cloak? How would you rename it? Justin Holland (talk) 23:40, April 25, 2013 (UTC)
I'd just leave it at the So and So's Jinchuriki Form articles. It's something Naruto did while in a tailed beast form. If anything, when a databook comes out, we'll probably get a definite name for and clearly defined limits for it, resulting in an article, and this will probably be mentioned at some point. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 23:44, April 25, 2013 (UTC)
OK, I guess. Justin Holland (talk) 23:47, April 25, 2013 (UTC)

Would merging the jinchuriki form articles be so insurmountable? They all follow the same structure (Initial, V1, V2, :Partial, Full) and, at least for 2-7, they don't say much that isn't already in the respective character's Abilities section. The only speed bump would be Naruto's additional "forms". ~SnapperTo 01:34, April 26, 2013 (UTC)

Wouldn't that article grow to be too unwieldy in terms of volume of content? Also bump, it's almost been a week and this is still here.--Cerez365Hyūga Symbol(talk)10:10, April 30, 2013 (UTC)
Wasn't the decision to mention it in Naruto's jinchuriki page and redirect it? That's what I thought the decision was.--TheUltimate3 Allied Shinobi Forces Symbol (talk) 10:29, April 30, 2013 (UTC)
As in, this page would redirect to Naruto Uzumaki's Jinchūriki Forms? --Cerez365Hyūga Symbol(talk) 10:31, April 30, 2013 (UTC)
Inserting song: "Want You Gone"--Elveonora (talk) 13:14, April 30, 2013 (UTC)
@Elveonora - 92% of your edits are to a talk or forum namespace. Please endeavor to indent your comments.
@Cerez - I don't know what would make it unwieldy. 2-7 are carbon copies of each other so that makes merging them very simple. Whatever form-traits that may be unique to a specific character can and probably already are detailed in that character's article. ~SnapperTo 00:12, May 6, 2013 (UTC)

isn't this case similar to the variants of the rasengan??? most the rasengan variants are just bigger rasengans, yet they have their own page, so this could be like a different way of using the tailed beast cloak (and apparently, only Naruto could have done this because he was a jinchuriki since birth) While it's just a tailed beast cloak, it's given to people that aren't jinchuriki; so it;s a tech in which Naruto is allowing other people to use the tailed beast cloak and he could protect them......--Deathmailrock (talk) 10:04, May 8, 2013 (UTC)

Yeah I thought the same thing. I don't think this should be under another page. This is not a generic jinchuriki ability. Kurama is like a battery that provides the chakra amount needed, yes, but if naruto didn't have the skill to a) synchronize with kurama's chakra and b) convert the chakra to others chakra type, then it wouldn't have have become "robust" in kakashi's words or formed the cloak aka tangibility. When kurama did it with kakashi it did not have the same results. Additionally, naruto is controlling the cloak on another persons body with the chakra arms. So that's a version one cloak, with remote chakra arm control, not only transferred but also converted (kurama stated himself that chakra transfer and conversion are different). Sorry but I don't see how merging this is a good idea. It has too many parent jutsus. It's similar to the rasengan variations or even tsunade's regular seal vs her strength of a hundred. Yeah these techniques are similar to their parent jutsus but the chakra control is unique enough to where it deserves its' own page. Not only that, but the kurama has stated that only naruto has the control over his chakra to preform it, which pretty much means we can expect this to be a naruto-exclusive technique. Just my 2 cents.--Jmmp (talk) 09:49, May 12, 2013 (UTC)
According to how I read it -- Naruto essentially injected (matched) Kurama's chakra to resonate with theirs, and the cloak appears because of the amount of chakra; Naruto is not controlling anything (so far as I can see) as far as chakra arms, and it appears that the techniques (and general strength) of everyone is also vastly improved by this newely flowing chakra. Instead, given the language I've seen used (may be a translation problem) appears to be that the shinobi under the effects are acting like the chakra receivers Nagato used, Naruto the conduit, and Kurama the source. It's simply transferring chakra, but at a VERY precise level -- like proteins and enyzmes, if you look at the pages where it is explained (apprx 5-7 on most sites, for Chapter 617). TL;DR: it's a normal chakra transferring method, but to an extraordinary degree of skill. This means anyone can do it, as anyone can transfer chakra. However, to spread Kurama's chakra required Naruto and all the other variables. As for continuing to pump out chakra, it's pretty self-explanatory how (I hope). He's simply pumping it out to, again, resonate with theirs, like chakra receivers, finding the wavelength. And as for "pseudo-Jinchuuriki" (or rather temporary), you could argue the point, given what's happening but that's not something worth discussing. --98.101.165.89 (talk) 15:41, May 14, 2013 (UTC)
How about this, all in favor of keeping this page say I. I Justin Holland (talk) 19:17, May 14, 2013 (UTC)
Anon, I think you completely missed the panel in which Kurama says Naruto is micromanaging the chakra. Still don't think the article is not warranted. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 19:29, May 14, 2013 (UTC)
I didn't miss it at all, and thought I had touched on it (especially with using Naruto rather than Kurama, when refering to anything; it'd also be a tad stupid to ignore the rest of the chapters and to think Kurama is doing it when Naruto is the one being exhausted)(though I know the intent to my own words, and others may not be able to read them as well as I)). I do not think the article is warranted either as it is normal chakra transferring, but sinply as such a large and precise level. --98.101.165.89 (talk) 21:51, May 14, 2013 (UTC)
We need to make a decision on this, people are starting to think of it as an actual technique (on and off Narutopedia) because of this article. It's either we keep it, or else delete it and mention the content elsewhere. My vote's with the latter of course because this is just sensationalising something that's basically a general skill.--Cerez365Hyūga Symbol(talk) 19:27, May 15, 2013 (UTC)
Unless we see Bee doing it too, I vote keep. Justin Holland (talk) 19:32, May 15, 2013 (UTC)

Such logic doesn't apply here, he would first need to be capable of the same thing Naruto is doing with the chakra management, meaning that part is unique to Naruto (and Minato) the rest is an ordinary chakra manipulation, meaning the manipulation itself is basic and doesn't warrant an article--Elveonora (talk) 19:43, May 15, 2013 (UTC)

I thought we already decided to delete it weeks ago, I don't even know why it's still up.--TheUltimate3 Allied Shinobi Forces Symbol (talk) 22:23, May 15, 2013 (UTC)
Because someone is yet to bother to delete it? Also there's this issue that many fans rely on our wikia as their source of information, suddenly deleting it will be confusing, since many have already accepted it as an established thing it would seem. But since we should be here to help in clearing up confusing rather than adding to it, we delete it now and if truly it is a technique than it will be brought up in manga or databook later on in more detail for sure, if that happens we simply recreate it.--Elveonora (talk) 11:56, May 16, 2013 (UTC)
It shouldn't exist as it proposes the idea that something is actually happening, when all that appears to have occurred is Naruto forcing out more and more chakra each time to the receivers. Most of what appears to be control seems to simply be just that -- pumping out more chakra. The only instance where any form of control occurs is when the tails block the projectiles, but there's no reason to suggest it is manual control, but perhaps merely more chakra being churned out, or something else (speculation). --98.101.165.89 (talk) 14:26, May 17, 2013 (UTC)
It is a manual control, but that's nothing strange. Lots of techniques remotely manipulate chakra. To get to the point, what defines a "new technique"? A character may grab some dust and dirt, throw it into an opponent's eyes and call it "leaf style: secret move - temporary blinding technique" and we would have to list it, nope? What Naruto does is more of a technique for sure, but he himself didn't recognize it as something new, it is just us fans making an article for 2 techniques being used together --Elveonora (talk) 15:02, May 17, 2013 (UTC)
Then maybe we should mention it as a skill, like naruto have been to use chakra transfer and tailed beast arms simultaneously to great effects to not only give the receivers a boost in their powers and abilities, but also protect them extremely powerful attacks from the likes of Obito, Madara Uchiha, and even a full nuclear blast from the ten-tails. Your thoughts? Justin Holland (talk) 19:55, May 17, 2013 (UTC)
It should already be in his abilities section--Elveonora (talk) 20:30, May 17, 2013 (UTC)

Elveonora is correct.--TheUltimate3 Allied Shinobi Forces Symbol (talk) 21:53, May 17, 2013 (UTC)

@Elv -- That's the thing, though, he doesn't call out name or anything, and if we go both the progression of what happens, when, and how, it coincides with him appearing to simply transfer more chakra. Aside from the tail incident, which IDK how to explain, it isn't "manual" anything, because that's the only time something that cannot be explained by transferring chakra occurs. When the arm grows, for instance, that is because he gives more chakra. And it isn't even tailed beast arms, either. The only part that moves to do anything are the tails of the cloaks. Aside from that, everything else is just the shinobi themselves attacking with SSJ-esque powers (their own techniques), and Naruto dispersing more chakra to increase potency of the cloak. (Stopped typing just now to re-read the chapters revolving around this "technique") I don't see anything other than the outlier that is the tail incident. If you can provide me examples where you think anything supports the ideas, be my guest. But I found nothing. Even with the tail incident, we can't be sure that is what happened, that Naruto made the tails themselves do it and that he just didn't disperse more chakra like he did with making the arms grow larger. The article, imo, is dramatizing what actually happened for the most part.I know the article is gone now, but I just wanted to try and perhaps help settle any lingering ideas, if possible, so we can all be on the same page. --98.101.165.89 (talk) 02:29, May 18, 2013 (UTC)
He has to touch to transfer chakra, what he did was manipulate it like chakra arms (the tails), the name is just a generic one, it can be cloak formed into anything and is still called as such, for example B's Lariat uses chakra horns--Elveonora (talk) 10:49, May 18, 2013 (UTC)

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