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Game images

I know this isn't usually done, but since we've got canon scenes in Ultimate Ninja Storm 3, should we use them in replacement of certain images (such as the one showing Kurama and Naruto teaming up) until an anime image comes up ? Or do we still want to use the manga images ? --Speysider Talk Page | My Image Uploads | Tabber Code | Channel 21:15, March 15, 2013 (UTC)

Can you show us the image first?--Elveonora (talk) 21:21, March 15, 2013 (UTC)
You'll have to wait for me to actually do the game on YT first to get the image, if someone else has the game and can get an image, feel free. --Speysider Talk Page | My Image Uploads | Tabber Code | Channel 09:36, March 16, 2013 (UTC)

False Info

Kurama was also believed to be played a role in enhancing the Uzumaki clan's healing ability that Naruto inherited from his mother.
Why is this mentioned ? Kurama's main abilities is to rapidly regenerate any damage to Naruto which is true so this statement should be reworded and cited. --Speysider Talk Page | My Image Uploads | Tabber Code | Channel 16:33, April 10, 2013 (UTC)

Did a databook actually ever confirm that Kurama heals Naruto, or rather stating that Kurama has a healing power just like Shukaku controls sand? Characters in-universe attribute it to the fox, doesn't make it true. The fox's chakra might as well only enhance Naruto's already extraordinary regeneration from his Uzumaki blood or something.--Elveonora (talk) 16:40, April 10, 2013 (UTC)

Did it ever say Uzumaki's had healing abilities? just that they had great vitality--Deathmailrock (talk) 20:49, May 31, 2013 (UTC)

Whats with the downplay?

Why is there a serious, concentrated effort to rob Kurama of the feats of durability or power he shown in the manga from the article? --SuperSaiyaMan (talk) 07:56, May 9, 2013 (UTC)

To me it appears to be a case of an opposite effort. No need to over-emphasize its feats and make it seem better than is--Elveonora (talk) 11:17, May 9, 2013 (UTC)
Getting the feats of durability and power in the manga are needed, it makes the article more accurate. There is a concentrated effort to rob anything that Kurama has done away from his article.--SuperSaiyaMan (talk) 19:06, May 9, 2013 (UTC)
Provide some links to edits you believe to remove valid information that is not stated elsewhere in the article already. — SimAnt 19:13, May 9, 2013 (UTC)

Black Ninetails?

was the nine tails in RTN really black??? cause when it was summoned, it looked kinda a bit red and when Naruto's Ninetails fought Menma's, they both looked black.... so it could have just been the lighting that he looked black--Deathmailrock (talk) 20:54, May 31, 2013 (UTC)

I believe Black Nine-Tails is the official name. Not sure where it came from exactly.--BeyondRed (talk) 21:00, May 31, 2013 (UTC)
Actually Black Nine-Tails is the official name, but yea it doesn't appear all that black in the movie. It did look kinda normal to me. But what is official is official and there's no changing that.  Teppei  talk  05:24, 6/1/2013 

could there be a source of where the name "Black Nine-Tails" came from? was it in the movie or a certain article?-- (talk) 08:34, June 1, 2013 (UTC)

Guys, I just saw the whole nine tails fight again, and I never heard any "kuro kyūbi" throughout.. There was this line "kyūbi to kyūbi no kyome.." in the film but it only means "Nine Tails and Nine Tails resonance..". So, I don't think "Black Nine-Tails" is official. Perhaps we can call it the "Nine Tails of the Limited Tsukuyomi World" or something like that but no Black Nine-Tails for sure.  Teppei  talk  13:10, 6/2/2013 

The Black Nine-Tails name is official. Check out the name of the song from the movie soundtrack. KazeKitsune (talk) 14:24, June 2, 2013 (UTC)

But they never refer to the other Kyūbi as "Kuro Kyūbi" in the movie. They only refer to it as "Kyūbi" and nothing else..  Teppei  talk  14:33, 6/2/2013 

Look in the movie black kurama and regular kurama are different because of their coler when they fought over the water you could see that Black Nine-Tails is indeed darker than Kurama so he is Black it's just the nighttime scence confuses things a bitWhiteraven1 (talk) 17:13, June 2, 2013 (UTC)(Whiteraven1)

Unique trait

Another thing I've been meaning to bring up. Shouldn't we be adding telepathy as a unique trait to all the Tailed Beasts? They have demonstrated it amongst themselves and their Jinchuriki. Skitts (talk) 20:54, July 11, 2013 (UTC)

It's mentioned on the main Tailed Beast page but yeah, it should be mentioned somewhere on their pages as well.TricksterKing (talk) 22:16, July 11, 2013 (UTC)

Separate article for the Yin Half?

Since it seems like the half of Kurama that was split is a full-fledged Tailed Beast with it's own mind and consciousness that's separate from he one sealed inside Naruto. Should we treat it as such and create a separate article for it? --M4ND0N (talk) 06:24, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

Nah. Same person, not enough separation to fill an article. Also, I suspect a merge soon. Best to think of this as being similar to Mu's splitting tech. Should change Minato from pseudo to full, though. MangekyoSasuke (talk) 06:30, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

I already took care of that. At the very least this Kurama has consciousness and therefore Minato's no less of a Jinchuriki to Kurama than Naruto is, so I went ahead noted it in the article. --M4ND0N (talk) 06:35, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

I would like people's opinion on this. I believe the "yin Kurama" was in fact already shown in Road to Ninja as "black nine-tails" I believe them to be the same. In the AU, Minato or Sakura's dad or whoever simply sealed Kurama's Yin into Naruto, not the Yang like in "real world" hence "black nine-tails" and as such, I believe we should have a separate article, since we do for Menma as an example--Elveonora (talk) 11:01, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

That is a lot of speculation, even for you, Elve. "Black Nine-Tails" was just a genjutsu variation of Kurama dreamed up by Obito. Nothing more, nothing less. Let's not dabble into the realms of the clinically insane here. As for the Yin-half of Kurama, I think this is going to be another Zetsu deal. They're two sides of the same coin, the same person/creature, that were split by a jutsu and can be just as easily restored. Being Kurama's Yin half doesn't make it any less Kurama than the half inside of Naruto. And, in any case, he was shown in one panel. We known nothing about him; zippo. Given the subtitles at the end of the chapter, we'll be given a formal introduction to him next week, so I suggest we all take a big deep breath, then let it out, and.... wait. It won't kill you. ~ Ten Tailed Fox Yamagakure Symbol 11:11, August 7, 2013 (UTC)
Edit: In addition, we don't have a separate article for Dark Naruto, despite the fact that he had a "mind of his own", if you will, and used techniques of his own. We also don't create new articles for the different halves of the original Zetsu, and they have two completely separate personalities. This is probably going to be handled similarly. ~ Ten Tailed Fox Yamagakure Symbol 11:13, August 7, 2013 (UTC)
Except "Dark Naruto" was only in Naruto's mind, not someone real--Elveonora (talk) 11:34, August 7, 2013 (UTC)
Doesn't matter. Dark Naruto was simply another part of Naruto's cognition. The same is the case here. Yin and Yang halves are both Kurama. They're not different people, creatures, nothing. They are one and the same. ~ Ten Tailed Fox Yamagakure Symbol 11:37, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

Ok, doesn't it strike you all as weird that we're trying to make Minato a full jinchuuriki when these powers were given to him as he was reincarnated? We don't know if the "Yin-Kurama" can be a tangible entity, or just the influence of Kurama's yin-chakra. Jinchuuriki's don't get reincarnated with a the tailed beast guys, especially not in canon. Senju SymbolKotoSenju (OldUser:JaZZBaND)-Talk-Contributions 12:40, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

Who said they don't? You forgot that Tobi's revived jinchuuriki died as a result of the process which resulted in removal of their tailed beasts, hence they died as non-jinchuuriki, that's why they were revived as such.
@Fox, It's not the same case, Minato has a fox with separate chakra and consciousness in him. Dark Naruto was simply a mental manifestation of his hatred and bad traits, it never existed outside of the waterfall meditation trance shit thingy--Elveonora (talk) 12:53, August 7, 2013 (UTC)
Its not a separate chakra. Its Kurama's chakra, just the other half of it. Its not a separate consciousness, because its, again, just the other half of Kurama's consciousness. It is simply the mass of whatever chakra Minato pulled out of Kurama 16 years ago. Even if, next week, it turns out that it is, in some ungodly way, different than Kurama, then it'll get mentioned in this page, just like we do with Zetsu. The point is, at the end of the day, regardless of all the other mumbo jumbo, they're both the same creature. ~ Ten Tailed Fox Yamagakure Symbol 12:57, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

If it's not sealed inside Naruto and it can think and talk and express viewpoints and opinions to the host it's sealed within [Minato] then it has consciousness. It's hard not to consider the Kurama inside Minato every bit as much Kurama as the one inside Naruto. As you said, they're two sides of the same coin, but they're separate right now and each half has it's own consciousness. So to call Minato a pseudo-Jinchuriki at this point is wrong in my opinion. Also, it's not completely unheard of for the separated chakra of a tailed beast to manifest as it's own TB. The Juubi's a perfect example of this, and I don't think it stops there. Kurama had half it's chakra taken away. So if the Ten Tails can have all it's chakra split and have each one manifest as a Tailed Beast, I don't see how it's inconceivable that the same happened to Kurama. Nonetheless, waiting till we get a proper explanation won't hurt. M4ND0N (talk) 15:56, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

We're not playing this game every time something like this happens. Its the same situation as Zetsu, either way you slice it. They stay on the same article because, like it or lump it, they're one in the same person. That's all that anyone who will ever see this wiki will ever care about. The fact that these guys want to make an entire new article, about a character that they only have a silhouette and one sentence from, and they claim to know all this information about what it is and how it was formed, is insanity's purest definition. All we would be able to offer is speculation. We don't know what that is, and Minato looks pretty shocked himself. It talks and it looks the Nine-Tails, but we don't know if its just that the Nine-Tails can speak to Minato through its Yin-half, if its Yin-half obtained mind of its own (whew, Kishi must be smoking some good pot for this stuff), or if its something new entirely. So, like I said at the beginning of this thread, we all need to show patience, and wait. A week won't kill anyone. I'm positive it'll be touched on next chapter. ~ Ten Tailed Fox Yamagakure Symbol 16:58, August 7, 2013 (UTC)
Edit: Slight note, but this is becoming a major pet peeve of mine. The Ten-Tails isn't a tailed beast. At all. No way in hell. Its an actual, physical, living, breathing animal, with a **** ton of chakra. Its chakra are the tailed beasts. There is a huge difference. And I don't remember reading anywhere that tailed beasts' chakra can break away and start forming tailed beast twins all over the place. If Minato is a jinchūriki, then Sora and the Gold and Silver Brothers are jinchūriki too, because all he got was chakra, which is all they got. Its ludicrous the logic that is being put behind this debate. ~ Ten Tailed Fox Yamagakure Symbol 17:03, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

Straight from the info box [---> Classification: Tailed Beast.] But that's not what we're talking about so I don't wanna have a debate discussing the Ten Tails being a TB or not, because it's irrelevant to this debate. You're right, it's speculation and it can wait till next week, I was simply asking what people thought of the idea in case it was something the majority of people would like to do or not. I'm completely neutral in this so don't think I'm trying to enforce either side of the debate. With that being said, your logic is flawed since as you said, there's no information indicating that a Tailed Beast can split it's chakra and that chakra becomes separate Tailed Beasts, but there's also no information indicating that this ISN'T the case either. Sora's a filler character so I don't know why you're bringing him up, and we've never been shown the inside of Ginkaku and Ginkaku's minds or subconscious to see if this is true or not either.

Anyway, I wrote this topic last night when the mangapanda translation was the only version I could read. Having re-read the chapter on mangastream it's possible that Kurama is talking to Minato through it's Yin half, but that's just as much speculation as Kurama's Yin half being a separate entity. We'll find out in the coming chapters so I agree that we should wait. --M4ND0N (talk) 00:03, August 8, 2013 (UTC)

Did not read all of the above, so my short opinion on the matter. I do not believe that we should have a split article for Yin Kurama. Yin Kurama is half of Kurama, but it's still Kurama, or do we intend to have an article on Kurama as a whole, on Yang Kurama, and Yin Kurama? Seems highly convoluted and unmanageable. We didn't split the main Zetsu character in two articles, even when they split and became independent of one another. However, I do think that we should start considering Minato a jinchuriki. The Yin Kurama appears to have its own volition and awareness, and if I had to guess, similar to Yang Kurama, it is probably responsible for its own sustenance/existence. Sora had chakra he couldn't control and it simply burned out. Besides, he's not canon. Kingin, on the other hand, while they appeared to be able to keep generating the chakra over time, I don't recall there being any trace or indication of an incarnation of will or mind of the Nine-Tails inside them. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 00:09, August 8, 2013 (UTC)

Wait, so when I brought this up, everyone opposed the change/removal of Ten-Tails' classification as a "tailed beast" yet now suddenly, months later, you Fox say it isn't. Where have you been when it was relevant? Anyway, chakra alone doesn't make a tailed beast. They have physical bodies, souls and minds. If they were just chakra, then each shinobi alliance would now have a fox talking to them and trying to take over. And define what differentiates a jinchuuriki from a pseudo-jinchuuriki? OH THAT'S RIGHT, the former have an actual beast in them... "looks at Minato, sees a fox" so he indeed isn't a pseudo at this point--Elveonora (talk) 11:07, August 8, 2013 (UTC)

It's obvious that the distinction between Jinchuuriki and pseudo is determined by how much of the chakra is sealed within the host in question. For example, because the tailed beasts ARE constructs of pure chakra, with flesh and consciousness supposedly formed from such high concentrations of it and half of Kurama's chakra was divided between Minato and Naruto, if one is considered a jinchuuriki so must the other.

Because a tailed beast's were crafted from pure chakra, that is where their consciousness lies. The question at hand however, is how much chakra has to be present in one location before their mind manifests AND is that mind separate from the consciousness in other locations.

If the half of Kurama's chakra inside Naruto has a consciousness, is it so hard to believe that the half in Minato does as well.

While I do not believe Yin Kurama deserves another article, I do believe he deserves to have his own section in this article acknowledging him as a separate entity and expanded upon as soon as more information is available.

That is my two cents on this subject. --Azekual (talk) 16:58, August 8, 2013 (UTC)

If the fox in Minato can produce/regenerate more chakra, that would make him a full jinchuuriki--Elveonora (talk) 17:16, August 8, 2013 (UTC)

Why shouldn't the fox in Minato be able to. Granted, we don't know for SURE if he can, but it stands to reason that if the Yang half in Naruto is capable of such, so is the Yin inside Minato. --Azekual (talk) 17:23, August 8, 2013 (UTC)

Elve, this time there's no winning it, unless Kishi retconed Kurama's sealing, Minato isn't a jinchūriki anymore than I am at this point. I (and you) watched him seal it. He only sealed the chakra because Kurama was still there after he sealed the Yin chakra inside of him. Go back and watch it again if you have to. There isn't a way on Heaven, Hell, Earth, or Purgatory he's a jinchūriki. Its not plausible. Its not sensible. And its certainly not a fact. I refuse to accept one panel and a silhouette as proof of anything. Next week, if it turns out I'm wrong, well then Kishi is smoking some serious pot, because we WATCHED Minato seal the chakra, not the beast. ~ Ten Tailed Fox Yamagakure Symbol 18:05, August 8, 2013 (UTC)
I smell bias and ignorance. I get you, it makes no sense to you, but in case you are wrong, you will simply have to get over it. His manga, his rules. It's not that far-fetched tho, doesn't Muu's technique do the exact same thing? (capable of splitting a dude both mentally and physically, likely soul too as well 0_0) So the concept isn't foreign.--Elveonora (talk) 18:58, August 8, 2013 (UTC)
Aren't tailed beasts called "chakra monsters"? Technically, they're made of chakra, it simply takes physical form. Regardless of the semantics, there's one key piece of information left for us to properly say anything without speculating: why Minato split the Yin and Yang. When Jiraiya revealed that, he said Minato went through the trouble of splitting Yin and Yang. We don't know why that is important, it could be trivial, or it could be the most important thing about this whole issue. Kingin were tinged with undivided chakra, both Yin and Yang, so it's possible for chakra to be separated without dealing with Yin and Yang, so that obviously still has importance. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 20:09, August 8, 2013 (UTC)
Either way, this whole thread has been pointless conjecture. We'll have our answer next week. I stated it in an earlier post, nobody here knows the significance of that shadow (save, apparently, Elve), what it means, how it got there, or even what it is, other than it talks. We've seriously, from one panel at the end of the last chapter, gone from "Oh hey, that's a thing." to "OMG Minato's a jinchūriki, and Kyūbi has a twin yin-half that is completely different in mind, body, and soul, and it's the Kyūbi from the Naruto movie (look up a bit, someone actually suggested that), and now, apparently, splitting tailed beasts chakra up creates new beasts, desu!" Its amusing, if not completely irritating. All I've been trying to stress is that next week, we'll know. I doubt Kishi foreshadowed that just to ignore it later. There's no point in jumping to all these conclusions. ~ Ten Tailed Fox Yamagakure Symbol 20:23, August 8, 2013 (UTC)
We might know next week. Jump is on break next week, so we either get the chapter way early, or we wait two weeks. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 20:33, August 8, 2013 (UTC)

That my good sir, is where you're wrong. There is a very good reason for this conjecture. For one, it is an exchange of ideas that helps predict what's coming and understand what as happened. But even more important than that, it's just plain fun. --Azekual (talk) 20:40, August 8, 2013 (UTC)

I thought predictions(and 'just plain fun') are what Forums are for, not Talk Pages. Blackchaos27 (talk) 20:53, August 8, 2013 (UTC)
^This. Talk pages are to be used to discuss how to improve the article, how to list the available information. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 20:58, August 8, 2013 (UTC)

As long as it relates closely with the topic of the page and overall attempts to contribute to the body of knowledge regarding the topic, there is no harm in it.--Azekual (talk) 21:02, August 8, 2013 (UTC)

Considering you have nothing more than a shadow as evidence, 99% of what's here is speculation and conjecture and, policy wise, as well as sanity wise, it doesn't belong on a talk page. ~ Ten Tailed Fox Yamagakure Symbol 02:21, August 9, 2013 (UTC)

So setting my projections to an event that will have more light shed on it in the near future when nobody else has any meaningful information on the subject either is wrong, eh?--Azekual (talk) 02:34, August 9, 2013 (UTC)

From the talk page policy;
"The Narutopedia is not a discussion forum, talkpages and forum pages should not be used for any discussion not related to improvement to the wiki itself."
So yes. Anything that is outside the realm of fact, as far as the manga is concerned, eg., pointless conjecture, and personal speculation is wrong and not allowed on our talk pages. ~ Ten Tailed Fox Yamagakure Symbol 02:49, August 9, 2013 (UTC)

We're not having a discussion about the story, we're discussing whether or not what we've seen warrants listing Minato as a Jinchuriki. You flat out said there's no way Minato's a Jinchuriki and if he is he'd be smoking serious pot and attacking people for disagreeing with you.. I don't think comments like that relate to improving the page either. With that being said, I'm neutral in this but you're speculating just as much as they are by saying that the Black Kurama isn't conscious and that it's just the fox's chakra, etc. If you come up with conclusions like that based off previous assumptions of what's possible or what isn't possible in the series then you clearly haven't learned from the Tobi's Identity fiasco that Kishi can do things with the story that don't initially make sense, or that you wouldn't necessarily agree with and end up explaining it and subsequently making it work. Assuming that this Kurama isn't it's own separate entity is speculation that could and might be disproven next week, so your rants against Elv and those other guys is just as much of a blatant misuse of the talk page as what you're claiming everyone else is doing. Let's just drop the discussion and speculation and wait till next week, because neither opinion is right with what little info we know. --M4ND0N (talk) 18:24, August 12, 2013 (UTC)

I think no, we don't need to separate the articles. It's the same beast and it's done nothing enough to warrant an article. By definition, Minato is a jinchuriki either way unless Naruto is a pseudo one. Waiting until the next 2 weeks (Jump's on break this week) for more info won't kill us though.--Cerez365Hyūga Symbol(talk) 18:32, August 12, 2013 (UTC)
That's a really good point that was brought up some time back. If Minato is a pseudo-jinchuuriki, so then is Naruto. If Naruto is a full jinchuuriki, then so is Minato. They both have two halves of the same thing in them, so either can't be something else than the other. Oh, and good post M4ND0N ^_--Elveonora (talk) 18:52, August 12, 2013 (UTC)
Wow I've never really thought about that so I guess you could say naruto's pseudo, lets see what more the the manga tells us --ROOT 19:31, August 12, 2013 (UTC)

You are right TTF, so ridiculous, black nine tails = yin kurama... I must be crazy, how could I come up with such a nonsense? "reads latest chapter" oh well, said who? ;D--Elveonora (talk) 12:24, August 17, 2013 (UTC)

Elve, the way you act sometimes is downright asinine. If you really expect the wiki to jump to conclusions based on a shadow, you're living on another planet. Now that these new chapters are out, I can honestly say, yes, there is a Yin Kurama. However, seeing as though they finish each other's sentences, and the fact that "Yin Kurama" called "Yang Kurama" itself ("Asking myself for help... this is getting weird."), I don't really think you have a point to begin with. They're still the same person. So, once again, this discussion is meaningless. They won't be getting different articles. Just like Black and White Zetsu didn't. ~ Ten Tailed Fox Yamagakure Symbol 08:20, August 18, 2013 (UTC)

Black Nine Tails = Yin Half?

Is it worth noting in trivia that the Black Nine Tails from RTN looks exactly like the Yin Half of Kurama? --M4ND0N (talk) 07:37, August 18, 2013 (UTC)

Nope. Not worth a trivia note at all. In the end, it's the same Nine-Tails as we've always known, just with slightly darker fur.--TheUltimate3 Allied Shinobi Forces Symbol (talk) 07:48, August 18, 2013 (UTC)

That's not what I mean. Judging by the similarities it's possible that Kishimoto had this planned and in the Alternate Universe Naruto [Menma] had the Yin half of Kurama's chakra sealed inside him instead of the Yang half. Either way speculating on a movie when there won't be any continuation of it is pointless, I just thought it was noteworthy how similar Yin Kurama and BNT looked. --M4ND0N (talk) 08:17, August 18, 2013 (UTC)

That's exactly what I was getting at above, but you know, ignorant people stay ignorant. There's no reason for Kurama in AU being black and Yin Kurama being black as well other than them being the same. That's not even far-fetched, but highly likely. Minato or rather Kizashi simply alternatively sealed the Yang part into himself and Yin into Naruto, I mean Menma.--Elveonora (talk) 12:56, August 18, 2013 (UTC)

Bump--Elveonora (talk) 12:17, August 19, 2013 (UTC)

I think it's at least worth noting that Yin Kurama is darker coloured than the one we normally get, though I've been working off the theory that the RTN Kurama was the Yin Chakra from the start, given the difference in abilities of their users. --Hawkeye2701 (talk) 20:12, August 19, 2013 (UTC)

Its been noted in the appearance section. @Elve: I don't think drawing needless conclusions to movie characters is wise nor prudent. Especially on nothing more than a bunch of guesses. Yin Kurama is darker, Black Kurama is darker. So what? That immediately means you get to draw conclusions on what half of Kurama was sealed within Menma/Naruto in the movie, or even if the Sakura's father used Dead Demon Consuming Seal in the first place to split the chakras? A whole bunch of pointless conjecture. What is listed on the page is what we know. The movie Kurama was called "Black Nine-Tails", and aside from being just that, we don't know the circumstance behind it. As well the mention that Kurama has a yin and a yang half, along with their color variations are mentioned in the article. That is plenty good enough, and doesn't dip into the realm of fantastical fan speculation. For all any of us know, Kishi colored the movie Kurama black because he was just having that kind of day. ~ Ten Tailed Fox Yamagakure Symbol 20:51, August 19, 2013 (UTC)
ok :-( --Elveonora (talk) 21:14, August 19, 2013 (UTC)
~gives Elve consolatory pat on back~ It happens to all of us. Raidra (talk) 19:00, August 21, 2013 (UTC)

Two separate entities, confirmed.

I guess I was right. Should we change the article accordingly and list both Yin and Yang Kurama as separate tailed beasts? --M4ND0N (talk) 08:10, August 28, 2013 (UTC)

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